Message ID | 20230309135718.1490461-1-usama.anjum@collabora.com (mailing list archive) |
---|---|
Headers | show |
Series | Implement IOCTL to get and optionally clear info about PTEs | expand |
On Thu, 9 Mar 2023 18:57:11 +0500 Muhammad Usama Anjum <usama.anjum@collabora.com> wrote: > The information related to pages if the page is file mapped, present and > swapped is required for the CRIU project [5][6]. The addition of the > required mask, any mask, excluded mask and return masks are also required > for the CRIU project [5]. It's a ton of new code and what I'm not seeing in here (might have missed it?) is a clear statement of the value of this feature to our users. I see hints that CRIU would like it, but no description of how valuable this is to CRIU's users. So please spend some time preparing this info. Also, are any other applications of this feature anticipated? If so, what are they? IOW, please sell this stuff to us!
Hi Andrew, Thank you for your message. On 3/10/23 12:58 AM, Andrew Morton wrote: > On Thu, 9 Mar 2023 18:57:11 +0500 Muhammad Usama Anjum <usama.anjum@collabora.com> wrote: > >> The information related to pages if the page is file mapped, present and >> swapped is required for the CRIU project [5][6]. The addition of the >> required mask, any mask, excluded mask and return masks are also required >> for the CRIU project [5]. > > It's a ton of new code and what I'm not seeing in here (might have > missed it?) is a clear statement of the value of this feature to our > users. Sorry, let me give some clear details about its value. > > I see hints that CRIU would like it, but no description of how valuable > this is to CRIU's users. > > So please spend some time preparing this info. > > Also, are any other applications of this feature anticipated? If so, > what are they? > > IOW, please sell this stuff to us! The real motivation for adding PAGEMAP_SCAN IOCTL is to emulate Windows GetWriteWatch() syscall [1]. > The GetWriteWatch{} retrieves the addresses of the pages that are written > to in a region of virtual memory. This syscall is used in Windows applications and games etc. This syscall is being emulated in pretty slow manner in userspace. Our purpose is to enhance the kernel such that we translate it efficiently in a better way. Currently some out of tree hack patches are being used to efficiently emulate it in some kernels. We intend to replace those with these patches. So the whole gaming on Linux can effectively get benefit from this. It means there would be tons of users of this code. CRIU use case [2] was mentioned by Andrei and Danylo: > Use cases for migrating sparse VMAs are binaries sanitized with ASAN, > MSAN or TSAN [3]. All of these sanitizers produce sparse mappings of > shadow memory [4]. Being able to migrate such binaries allows to highly > reduce the amount of work needed to identify and fix post-migration > crashes, which happen constantly. At [10]: > For Andrei's use case is to iteratively dump memory. @Andrei and Danylo can elaborate more on their use cases. *Implementation Evolution (Short Summary)* From the definition of GetWriteWatch(), we feel like kernel's soft-dirty feature can be used under the hood with some additions like: * reset soft-dirty flag for only a specific region of memory instead of clearing the flag for the entire process * get and clear soft-dirty flag for a specific region atomically So we decided to use ioctl on pagemap file to read or/and reset soft-dirty flag. But using soft-dirty flag, sometimes we get extra pages which weren't even written. They had become soft-dirty because of VMA merging and VM_SOFTDIRTY flag. This breaks the definition of GetWriteWatch(). We were able to by-pass this short coming by ignoring VM_SOFTDIRTY until David reported that mprotect etc messes up the soft-dirty flag while ignoring VM_SOFTDIRTY [5]. This wasn't happening until [6] got introduced. We discussed if we can revert these patches. But we could not reach to any conclusion. So at this point, I made couple of tries to solve this whole VM_SOFTDIRTY issue by correcting the soft-dirty implementation: * [7] Correct the bug fixed wrongly back in 2014. It had potential to cause regression. We left it behind. * [8] Keep a list of soft-dirty part of a VMA across splits and merges. I got the reply don't increase the size of the VMA by 8 bytes. At this point, we left soft-dirty considering it is too much delicate and userfaultfd [9] seemed like the only way forward. From there onward, we have been basing soft-dirty emulation on userfaultfd wp feature where kernel resolves the faults itself when WP_ASYNC feature is used. It was straight forward to add WP_ASYNC feature in userfautlfd. Now we get only those pages dirty or written-to which are really written in reality. (PS There is another WP_UNPOPULATED userfautfd feature is required which is needed to avoid pre-faulting memory before write-protecting [9].) All the different masks were added on the request of CRIU devs to create interface more generic and better. [1] https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/api/memoryapi/nf-memoryapi-getwritewatch [2] https://lore.kernel.org/all/20221014134802.1361436-1-mdanylo@google.com [3] https://github.com/google/sanitizers [4] https://github.com/google/sanitizers/wiki/AddressSanitizerAlgorithm#64-bit [5] https://lore.kernel.org/all/bfcae708-db21-04b4-0bbe-712badd03071@redhat.com [6] https://lore.kernel.org/all/20220725142048.30450-1-peterx@redhat.com/ [7] https://lore.kernel.org/all/20221122115007.2787017-1-usama.anjum@collabora.com [8] https://lore.kernel.org/all/20221220162606.1595355-1-usama.anjum@collabora.com [9] https://lore.kernel.org/all/20230306213925.617814-1-peterx@redhat.com [10] https://lore.kernel.org/all/20230125144529.1630917-1-mdanylo@google.com
On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 11:58 AM Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org> wrote: > > On Thu, 9 Mar 2023 18:57:11 +0500 Muhammad Usama Anjum <usama.anjum@collabora.com> wrote: > > > The information related to pages if the page is file mapped, present and > > swapped is required for the CRIU project [5][6]. The addition of the > > required mask, any mask, excluded mask and return masks are also required > > for the CRIU project [5]. > > It's a ton of new code and what I'm not seeing in here (might have > missed it?) is a clear statement of the value of this feature to our > users. > > I see hints that CRIU would like it, but no description of how valuable > this is to CRIU's users. Hi Andrew, The current interface works for CRIU, and I can't say we have anything critical with it right now. On the other hand, the new interface has a number of significant improvements: * it is more granular and allows us to track changed pages more effectively. The current interface can clear dirty bits for the entire process only. In addition, reading info about pages is a separate operation. It means we must freeze the process to read information about all its pages, reset dirty bits, only then we can start dumping pages. The information about pages becomes more and more outdated, while we are processing pages. The new interface solves both these downsides. First, it allows us to read pte bits and clear the soft-dirty bit atomically. It means that CRIU will not need to freeze processes to pre-dump their memory. Second, it clears soft-dirty bits for a specified region of memory. It means CRIU will have actual info about pages to the moment of dumping them. * The new interface has to be much faster because basic page filtering is happening in the kernel. With the old interface, we have to read pagemap for each page. Thanks, Andrei > > So please spend some time preparing this info. > > Also, are any other applications of this feature anticipated? If so, > what are they? > > IOW, please sell this stuff to us!
On Mon, Mar 20, 2023 at 11:30:00AM -0700, Andrei Vagin wrote: > On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 11:58 AM Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org> wrote: > > > > On Thu, 9 Mar 2023 18:57:11 +0500 Muhammad Usama Anjum <usama.anjum@collabora.com> wrote: > > > > > The information related to pages if the page is file mapped, present and > > > swapped is required for the CRIU project [5][6]. The addition of the > > > required mask, any mask, excluded mask and return masks are also required > > > for the CRIU project [5]. > > > > It's a ton of new code and what I'm not seeing in here (might have > > missed it?) is a clear statement of the value of this feature to our > > users. > > > > I see hints that CRIU would like it, but no description of how valuable > > this is to CRIU's users. > > Hi Andrew, > > The current interface works for CRIU, and I can't say we have anything > critical with it right now. > > On the other hand, the new interface has a number of significant improvements: > > * it is more granular and allows us to track changed pages more > effectively. The current interface can clear dirty bits for the entire > process only. In addition, reading info about pages is a separate > operation. It means we must freeze the process to read information > about all its pages, reset dirty bits, only then we can start dumping > pages. The information about pages becomes more and more outdated, > while we are processing pages. The new interface solves both these > downsides. First, it allows us to read pte bits and clear the > soft-dirty bit atomically. It means that CRIU will not need to freeze > processes to pre-dump their memory. Second, it clears soft-dirty bits > for a specified region of memory. It means CRIU will have actual info > about pages to the moment of dumping them. > > * The new interface has to be much faster because basic page filtering > is happening in the kernel. With the old interface, we have to read > pagemap for each page. There is still a caveat in using userfaultfd for tracking dirty pages in CRIU because we still don't support C/R of processes that use uffd. > Thanks, > Andrei > > > > > So please spend some time preparing this info. > > > > Also, are any other applications of this feature anticipated? If so, > > what are they? > > > > IOW, please sell this stuff to us!
On Tue, Mar 21, 2023 at 02:41:53PM +0200, Mike Rapoport wrote: > On Mon, Mar 20, 2023 at 11:30:00AM -0700, Andrei Vagin wrote: > > On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 11:58 AM Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org> wrote: > > > > > > On Thu, 9 Mar 2023 18:57:11 +0500 Muhammad Usama Anjum <usama.anjum@collabora.com> wrote: > > > > > > > The information related to pages if the page is file mapped, present and > > > > swapped is required for the CRIU project [5][6]. The addition of the > > > > required mask, any mask, excluded mask and return masks are also required > > > > for the CRIU project [5]. > > > > > > It's a ton of new code and what I'm not seeing in here (might have > > > missed it?) is a clear statement of the value of this feature to our > > > users. > > > > > > I see hints that CRIU would like it, but no description of how valuable > > > this is to CRIU's users. > > > > Hi Andrew, > > > > The current interface works for CRIU, and I can't say we have anything > > critical with it right now. > > > > On the other hand, the new interface has a number of significant improvements: > > > > * it is more granular and allows us to track changed pages more > > effectively. The current interface can clear dirty bits for the entire > > process only. In addition, reading info about pages is a separate > > operation. It means we must freeze the process to read information > > about all its pages, reset dirty bits, only then we can start dumping > > pages. The information about pages becomes more and more outdated, > > while we are processing pages. The new interface solves both these > > downsides. First, it allows us to read pte bits and clear the > > soft-dirty bit atomically. It means that CRIU will not need to freeze > > processes to pre-dump their memory. Second, it clears soft-dirty bits > > for a specified region of memory. It means CRIU will have actual info > > about pages to the moment of dumping them. > > > > * The new interface has to be much faster because basic page filtering > > is happening in the kernel. With the old interface, we have to read > > pagemap for each page. > > There is still a caveat in using userfaultfd for tracking dirty pages in > CRIU because we still don't support C/R of processes that use uffd. This reminded me whether the interface can also expose soft-dirty as a ranged soft-dirty collector too to replace existing pagemap read()s? Just in case userfault cannot be used. The code addition should be trivial IIUC. Then maybe PAGE_IS_WRITTEN will be a name too generic, it can be two bits PAGE_IS_UFFD_WP and PAGE_IS_SOFT_DIRTY, having PAGE_IS_UFFD_WP the inverted meaning of current PAGE_IS_WRITTEN.